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>> i ask president obama to do the right thing. the united states must renounce its which hunt against wikileaks. the united states must dissolve
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its fbi investigation. >> as julian assange remains holed up in the ecuadorean embassy in london, we look at a new documentary called "we steal secrets: the story of wikileaks ." today, academy award winning filmmaker alex gibney, and jennifer robinson, legal counsel to assange. >> the laws cannot protect us. >> the new documentary examines how millions have died from aids because big pharmaceutical companies and the united states refused to allow developing nations to import life-saving generic drugs. we speak with the film's director and and a doctor, peter
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mugyenyi, who was arrested trying to import generic drugs into the gondola. -- uganda. this is democracy now!,, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. the obama administration has again delayed its decision on the keystone xl will pipeline, now saying it will not come before march. president obama initially sidestepped the issue in 2011 by putting it off until after the election. on tuesday, the state department confirmed the white house would not make a decision in the year's first quarter. there was an announcement of support from nebraska governor dave heineman. in a letter to the white house, he signed off on the section of the proposed keystone route from canada after it was redesigned to avoid a key october.
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-- aquafor. does organizing a presidents' day rally against the pipeline in washington, d.c. next month. the supreme court has refused to hear in this group challenge of the epa to set standards for air pollution. the move leaves intact a 2010 regulation limiting regulations of sulfur dioxide. president obama has tacitly endorsed a house republican plan to lift the debt ceiling for the next four months. the measure would lift enforcement of the government's $16.40 trillion borrowing limit until may 18.
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in a statement, the white house said it would not oppose the temporary move. a house vote is expected today. protests on both sides of the reproductive rights debate were held on tuesday to mark the 40th anniversary of roe v wade, the supreme court decision that legalized abortion. dozens of opponents rallied outside the supreme court's ahead of what they say will be a larger march near capitol hill on friday. meanwhile in jackson, mississippi, abortion rights advocates held a demonstration outside of the state's lone abortion clinic which has faced repeated threats of closure. a new poll coinciding with the fourth anniversary shows national support for abortion rights is at an all-time high. a record 70% of americans oppose overturning roe v wade, and for the first time on record, a majority now believes abortion
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should be legal in all or most cases. two people are in custody after a shooting left three wounded, one critically at a college campus near houston, texas. the incident at lone star college marked the third shooting at a u.s. school or college in the past two weeks. the 15-year-old boy that is accused of shooting dead five members of his family continued on his rampage before he was caught. griego is in custody for allegedly killing his parents and three siblings. each of the victims suffered multiple gunshot wounds. police say he was armed with several weapons, including an assault rifle, and had planned to shoot more victims at a local wal-mart. at least four people have been killed in the latest u.s. drone strike in yemen. the victims were reportedly driving from what officials call a militant training ground when
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they were hit. it was the fourth attack inside yemen in as many days. recent drone strikes have sparked at least two protests this month by outraged residents who've claimed the loss of civilian life. also on tuesday, a yemeni cabinet member became the first to forcefully criticize the drone strikes in public. hooria mashhour denounced the drone strikes and called on the yemeni government to conduct ground operations instead of bombings fromtless the sky. the u.s. declared militants as enemies can be targeted wherever they are found. all we are calling for is justice and reliance on international regulations and to be true to our commitment to our citizens and that they all deserve a fair trial.
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the u.s. has begun transporting french troops and equipment as part of its part of the pain he intervention in mali. the u.s. is also assisting france with intelligence, potentially with surveillance drones. at least 17 people were killed across iraq on tuesday in a series of bombings. the deadliest attack occurred where a suicide bomber killed seven people and wounded 24 near an army base. in israel, prime minister benjamin netanyahu has claimed victory in israel's national election. his right wing black armored -- emerged on tuesday with a slight advantage. he will be forming a government coalition including right wing parties. here in this country, the
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victims of child molestation by priests in the los angeles catholic church are demanding justice following the disclosure that top church officials conspired to conceal the abuser 's crimes. newly disclosed documents have confirmed the roman catholic archdiocese of los angeles the liver they hid evidence of child molestation for more than decade, to bring abusive priests out of state to avoid prosecution. vega, a child abuse victim that was part of a 2007 settlement, called for a new investigation of the now retired archbishop and his top adviser. >> to feel that hands of the priest on my neck, to feel the breath on my neck, to feel him talk to me, to feel his body against me, the feeling violated
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me. there smells, -- there are smells, touches, feelings. you have to put yourself in that situation to understand what the catholic church is protecting. clergy, nuns, attorneys, all got together and spoke about, in secret, and made these deals to protect these priests. >> the files of around 75 priests accused of abuse are slated to become public in the coming weeks under the terms of the 2007 settlement. a pentagon probe has cleared general john allen, the top u.s. commander in afghanistan, of wrongdoing in a scandal that brought down david petraeus last year. allen was investigated after the
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fbi uncovered what it called potentially inappropriate e- mails between allen and jill kelley, the woman who complained about harassment from petraeus' lover paula broadwell. general allen succeeded petraeus in afghanistan in 2011. those are some of the headlines. this is democracy now!,, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. we are broadcasting from park city, utah, at the sundance film festival. we begin today's program with "we steal secrets: the story of wikileaks," a documentary that examines the key players involved in the release of hundreds of thousands of secret u.s. diplomatic cables to the website wikileaks. let's go to a clip of the film
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which begins with former state department spokesperson t. j. crowley, who resigned days after, accusing the pentagon of being ridiculous and counterproductive and stupid in its treatment of suspected army whistleblower private bradley manning. >> this leak is industrial scale, it touches every relationship the united states has with other countries of around the world. even as the u.s. and others tried to manage the impact of this, it will be a wound that keeps opening up on a recurring basis. the emir of the united states was also exposed. the cables revealed criminal cover-up and a systematic policy using diplomats to spy on foreign governments. >> everyone has secrets. some of the activity that nation states conduct in order to keep their people safe and free the to be secret in order to be successful. if they are broadly known, you
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cannot accomplish your work. let me be very candid. we steal secrets. we steal other nation's secrets. one cannot do that aboveboard and be successful for a very long period of time. >> the person who uses the phrase "we steal secrets" is michael hayden. the founder of wikileaks, julian assange, features prominently in the film. he remains holed up in the ecuadorean embassy in london where he sought refuge last year in order to avoid extradition to sweden and ultimately the u.s. meanwhile, a bradley manning, the individual accused of leaking documents to wikileaks, will be on trial next week.
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the colonel saito talk more aboe are joined here at the sundance film festival by the director alex gibney, the oscar-award winning filmmaker. his other films include "mea maxima culpa : silence in the house of god," "enron: the smartest guys in the room." "taxi to the dark side" focuses on a taxi driver in afghanistan. you were awarded the academy award for that film. it is good to have you with us. tell us why you decided to do this film "we steal secrets: the story of wikileaks." >> originally when i was brought
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into this -- i got a call from universal to take it on. i took it on because i thought it was the ultimate david and goliath story. julian assange, the silver surfer of the internet, taking on the biggest superpowers. it seemed like a classic david and goliath story for me at the beginning. >> and then what happened? >> there are a lot of components to the story. one, i discover the character of bradley manning. i did not think i would spend so much time on him. he is an incredibly sympathetic character. at the moment of assange's greatest fame, his rigorous adherence to the truth, maybe, -- changed, let me put it that
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way. >> what do you mean? >> the biggest problem i have with julian assange was over the swedish episode. questions were raised about his debut with two women in sweden. a lot of people, including me, thought at the time that this was some sort of obvious honey trap, a cia plot to prevent him from leakingny further documents. it turns out it is not that. in my view, it is a story about but itn and two wiomen, has been more to do something different by julian assange, and i believe he believes something which is not true, which is the united states is trying to manipulate the swedish judicial process in order to send him to the by the states for trial. >> and why do you think that is
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not true? >> there is no evidence for that. we know there is a grand jury investigation of julian assange, but there is no evidence that the united states is manipulating the swedish legal process in any way shape, -- any way, shape, or form. if he goes to sweden, and extradition proceedings were to united kingdom would have to sign up on that. he has had an extraordinary number of legal appeals in the u.k. whether or not these questions are legitimate, charges have not been brought up. he has an extraordinary amount of legal opportunity to bring this case, but he has not been successful. >> do you think he should be concerned -- we will be speaking
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to jennifer robinson, his legal adviser, in the next segment. they cannot get assurance from the swedish government that they will not extradite him to the united states. >> i do not think any government would give any individual that assurance. he wants to be above the law. if any government receives an extradition request from another country, they have to process it to see if it is legitimate. of "wes go to a clip steal secrets: the story of wikileaks." you are following julian assange as he is about to deliver a news conference on the publication of the afghan war logs, the massive trove of documents that exposed the u.s. role in afghanistan. it begins with the voice of baena australian journalist mark davis. >> he woke up late, of course,
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knocking on the door of julien. wake up. the normal things. >> i will be two minutes. >> 14 pages in the "the guardian closed with this morning. -- "the guardian" this morning. >> there are 10 media trucks out there. >> yes. it will be a good outcome. >> he walked out that door. by the time he had made this 50- yard walk, he was a rock star,
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one of the most famous guys on the planet. >> he walks into the club where he delivers this news conference. alex gibney, take it from there. >> an extraordinary moment. this guy that few people had ever heard of walks in and presides over this tremendous release of documents which revealed the truth about the afghan war, truths that we did not know about civilian casualties, an assassination squad. it was a lifting of the curtain of what was happening in afghanistan which will not been told by our government. >> in the film, you focus on that moment, july 12, 2007, and video that doing assange got a hold of and released, that took place over an area of baghdad. talk about the significance of what wikileaks released.
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>> they released a videotape of an apache gunship attack on some individuals. it is a shocking bit of footage for all sorts of reasons. one, the helicopter is so high above the ground, nobody on the ground could see it. the helicopter pilot sees these individuals. assange was able to get the camera on board. they've requested permission to engage and ended up killing what ended up to be civilians and two reuters journalists, as well as within a couple of children. and then another man who is try to take his kids to school try to rescue some of the men. >> then you hear on the video, that is what they get for
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bringing their father into a war zone. >> you hear a lot of vicious commentaries from the soldiers. it is awful, honestly. it is probably not typical, in terms of the kind of comments you would see from soldiers in the field, but the actual disparity of the weaponry being utilized by this helicopter -- the ordinance is just titanic and these people are wandering around in the street with little or nothing. it is a shocking look at modern warfare, where you can see the devastation raining down from above. >> talk about why you thought it was critical to highlight this as julian assange was releasing these documents. what did it symbolize? >> a valuable role that wikileaks was playing, in terms of releasing materials that were otherwise being kept secret,
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unnecessarily. one of the big stories of this film is how the u.s. government run it over classified material. in the case of collateral murder, voters even asks for a copy. two of their employees had been killed. the army said it was classified. it turns out, there was already a transcript of this in a book that was written by a pulitzer- prize winning author. and the army since admitted it was not classified. so you have to ask yourself, what kind of games is the army playing with the classification? it is one of the things that the bradley manning case brings out. this radical over classification of things that keeps us from seeing what is going on. >> you begin the film in the 1980's in australia.
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>> it's called the wank worm attack. it is one of the first examples of the computer attack against nasa. there were a lot of anti-nuclear activists met were concerned about a project that would blow up and rain down on earth. just before launch this computer message pops up in the nasa computers that says wank, worms against nuclear killers, and then there is a lyric from midnight oil, and then later on there was questioned about whether or not doing assange was involved in that. he will never say that he was or
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was not involved. >> the lyric was? >> you talk a lot times of peace, but then you prepare for war. it is very much a kind of thing that happens on the internet. the power that the government has and the countervailing power that citizens have. it also places julian assange in that milburn hacker community from which he ultimately emerged. >> you take it from their right through the arab spring, as we approached the second anniversary of the egyptian uprising, january 25. you talk about wikileaks having contributed to the uprisings in the middle east.
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>> i do not think there is any question. it would be far-fetched to say that it cost the average spring, but nevertheless, the revelation of many of these cables pulled the curtain back. you see many honest state department representatives talking about the real corruption, dishonesty, and appalling tyranny of some of the regimes in tunisia, egypt, libya. when they were released, it was tremendous validation of a lot of critics of the government. >> you talk about julian assange and bradley manning in your film. they focus on on the transcripts of online chats that brandi manning had with computer hacker adrian lamo, who would later turn in brandi
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manning. i want to read some of manning's words. you have them typed across the screen in the movie. "if you had free reign to that works, saw incredible things that belonged in the public domain and not in some server stored in a dark room in washington, d.c., what would you do? he goes on to write, i want people to see the truth. without that, you cannot make informed decisions as a public." >> a powerful statement by bradley manning, indicating that he was very much concerned and that he had some sense that what he was doing was an act of whistleblowing. it is not a classic act of whistleblowing because the quantity of documents released and the manner in which they were released is rather different than a classic whistleblower, but nevertheless, you can see he is concerned there is this whole level of dialogue taking place outside of
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the public eye. he was not an officer in iraq at the time, a low level specialist, analyst in iraq. >> this is another of the transcripts that you highlight between manning and lamo. "hillary clinton and several thousand diplomats are going to have a heart attack when they wake up and they find an entire repository of documents will be available to the public. it is climategate with a global scope. breathtaking depth. it is beautiful and horrifying." >> he sees this fast array of documents. there are two levels. there is the public display of diplomacy, and then undergirding it, sometimes very inspiring
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messages between diplomats talking about what is really going on. to be honest, amy, i think many of us would be appalled if every time, every communication between diplomats or soldiers in the field were summarily meet by every private working for the army or state department, but i think, what this represents to me is a kind of wholesale corrected. too much has been held two secret for too long. this was a kind of bold, may be ill-considered -- i do not want to use the word ill-considered -- i am not sure he considered the full documents or -- the consequences or read every document, but it shows us
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something that is being kept from us. there is a whole level of dialogue that americans should be seeing. >> and the link between brandi manning and julian assange. >> julian assange has always maintained that he does not know -- or that he did not know the documents that came to him were given to him by bradley manning. the military has slowly been leaking chats between assange and manning. >> the military is making these. how do you know that they are actually between julian assange and brenda manning? in the film, you put quotations
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around julie assange. >> in bradley manning's computer, -- it was introduced as evidence now, so we will see if that is challenged in court. manning's attorney has already gone to the court, in an unusual way, to say that they are prepared to plead guilty to a number of more minor offenses having to do with taking data off of classified networks and leaking them to wikileaks. i think what they discovered on bradley manning's computer was that the address of these chats , manning had, in his address book, it indicated that one of these addresses was that of julian assange. >> have you been subpoenaed in any way for the interview that
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you have done? >> no. >> ultimately, what did you learn, what were you most surprised by doing this documentary? >> that is a good question. in a way, i came into the story thinking of that this was about this machine, a leaking machine, this ability to post things all over the world on mirror sites that cannot be taken down. that is a more important innovation. the drop box was not that important. ultimately, this is a story about people. this whole process of leaking, moral decisions that have been made of what should be secret and what should not, have been made by often noble, sometimes
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flawed figures. i think the story has been misperceived as a story of political stick figures, whereas it is a human story that should be seen as that. the other thing is the way in which we are all trying to understand what happens on the internet. we assume it is a machine for freedom, which is, but it is also a surveillance mission for the government, and peculiarly enough, it is also an maelstrom of cruelty. people behind various names to deliver vectors of insult, which we discovered with what happened in sweden. it is really about modern life, but it is about this battle between what should be and what should not be secret. >> did you interview julian assange? >> no, i never did. there were times where he agreed to be, but ultimately, i never
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interviewed him. there was a six-hour conversation that i had with him at the norfolk manor where he was under house arrest -- >> but you did not get to interview him? >> no, but i did not get to interview the pope be there. [laughter] -- pope either. >> filmmaker, alex gibney. his latest movie "we steal secrets: the story of wikileaks" is playing here at the sundance film festival. when we come back, and jennifer robinson, legal advisor to julian assange. then we look at another film that has just premiered, "fire
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in the blood. ." we speak to a ugandan doctor who was in prison for trying to bring in generic drugs to do with aids.
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[♪] >> this is democracy now!,, the war and peace report. we are broadcasting from park city, utah from the sundance film festival. to talk more about the documentary "we steal secrets: the story of wikileaks," we are joined by jennifer robinson, legal counsel to julian assange. what were your thoughts about the film? >> this film touches on incredibly important subject matter. it is about wikileaks, touches
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on in foreign issues about journalism and whistleblowing, but unfortunately, i do not think the film does justice to those issues. >> why? >> filmmaking has its challenges and out of kidney has made some fabulous films, but you have to make choices in film making. this film the unrecognized wikileaks faces from the judicial system. it does not recognize the threats that he faces. in particular, the film states -- there is a grand jury in existence. there is an end acto with ongoing criminal investigation against julian assange. it was discovered through diplomatic cables to the australian government that the
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-- that is an incredible oversight. >> i wanted to play a clip of julian assange. when we interviewed him, he was speaking from the ecuadoran embassy in london. this is the clip where i asked him why he believes, if he were sweat -- sent to sweden, that he could be extradited to the united states, and when he was negotiating with the swedish government. >> ecuador has really stepped up to the plate and must be congratulated. i have been found to be a political refugee and have been given political asylum in relation to what has been happening in the united states and allied countries, sweden,
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the united kingdom. the situation for me now is that i have been here for five months. prior to that, 18 months under house arrest. prior to that, being chased around the world for around six months by u.s. intelligence and its allies. i must correct an earlier statement that you made -- this has become common in the press -- saying that i was here in relation to sweden. the reason i am here is essentially in relation to the united states. the swedish government said publicly that it would in prison me without charge, and in such a situation would not be able to apply for asylum. the ecuadorian government has asked the swedish permit to give a guarantee that i would not be
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extradited to the united states. all the regular processes have been refused in this case. it is an extremely odd and bizarre case which i encourage everyone to look at at you can see all the material that the police claim to be true, other things that have occurred under cambridge condemning the proceedings ever hear. >> that was julian assange speaking to us from the ecuadorean embassy. it is not clear when he will come out. jennifer robinson is our guest now, the legal adviser to julian assange. your response to alex gibney,
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saying, why should he get assurance that he was extradited to the nine states? the swedish government would take that in turn if the request came in. >> we are not suggesting that he is above the law. this film fest to recognize the reason that he was granted asylum, not related to sweden. he has offered his testimony with respect to sweden. [inaudible]
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>> this is democracy now!,, the war and
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peace report. i'm amy goodman. we are broadcasting from the sundance film festival in park city, utah. we had an extended break because we lost our satellite link. we wanted to thank jennifer robinson for joining us, legal counsel to julian assange. return now to what some are calling the crime of the century. tens of millions were prevented from receiving affordable, generic aids drugs. million died as a result. this is part of the trailer of "fire in the blood." over 2 million people reported to have died in the year. >> the whole of africa was taken for a ride. >> it is fine for rich countries to say that this is how it ought to be.
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they did not have to live in these villages and watch people dying like flies. >> the drugs is where the disease is not. >> you fight our monopolies. we will make sure you die. >> as drop -- as long as drugs are not available to everybody, he will not take them. >> it is a crisis of humanity. >> that is an excerpt of "fire in the blood," the movie of the big pharmaceutical and stopping the importation of cheap generic drugs. in many countries this practice continues because of a trade deal. "fire in the blood"just had its american premiere here at the
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sundance film festival. we are joined by the director of "fire in the blood" and dr. peter mugyenyi, a you gotten aids doctor featured in the film, recognized as one of the foremost specialists in the field of hiv aids. he played a key role in founding the joint research center in new gone deaf -- uganda. dillon, let's begin with you, why you made the film. >> the story came to me by accident. i was working on a film industry lock that in 2004. i had a day off and happen to read an article in "economist" of all things. it was about an indian generic drug maker brain in low-cost antiviral medications to africa.
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but it seems that there was something interesting going on underneath the surface. this this a good thing that he was doing with their going out of their way to attack him, but it was not clear why. this piqued my interest. not long later i had the chance to meet dr. hamied. through him i met some of the other people that became cashoo this to the film. i used to be in the academic world. the historian in me was completely shocked that i did not know more about the story and that there was so little written about it. there were no comprehensive account of what had happened. something that had killed 10 million people, seemingly without record. the impetus to make the film was primarily to create a record of -- a memorial, a chronicle of what happened. we consider this to be the crime of the century. >> dr. mugyenyi is featured in
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the film. is an honor to have you here before you go back, to uganda, where you were jailed for trying to bring in generic drugs. explain what the head of supplanted, the head of this drug company, how he challenged the rest of the world, saying that he would cut the prices of aids drugs. the amount of people would have to pay for the triple cocktail, before and after? >> there was worldwide misinformation that aids drugs were too expensive to manufacture. it was also said that it was
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impossible to use these drugs in african conditions. dr. hamied called the bluff of all the people who are propagating this information. >> how? >> well, he literally announced, it is not true that drugs have to be produced at an exorbitant cost. they could be produced at a relatively affordable cost. it was the issue of affordability and access where hamied came in. >> before him, drug companies would charge $15,000 for one patient to get the triple cocktail for the year. he cut that price to less than $1 a day? $15,000 to $15 for the year?
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>> yes, incredible. for the first time, millions of people who were dying in africa stopped dying because they had access to this life-saving drug. >> why did you end up in jail in uganda? >> i was arrested but then i was rescued because the government was concerned about the plight of the citizens who were dying in such big numbers. so an emergency meeting accused me of a rest -- recused me of a rest, and i met with the ministers and made it clear, look, your relatives are dying of aids, your citizens are dying of aids. the doctors that are working
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have no tools to save the patients' lives. all i have done is in for affordable drugs which would increase access. these drugs are at the airport, they are under your care. as far as i'm concerned, i have done my job of bringing life- saving drugs to uganda. i think they understood. everyone of them had relatives who were suffering from aids, or at least a friend who they knew had died from aids. it was not very difficult to convince them that this action was necessary and that they needed to be saving lives with these drugs. >> another of the heroes in the fight to bring lifesaving drugs to aids patients was an individual who went on a
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solidarity strike because of this could not get treatment. >> if my brothers or sisters or cousins had hiv and i grew up in a house, my mother would say, if all the kids cannot have chocolate, no one can have it. >> having made that is mined, zackie ocsla said that he would boycott antiviral until the government made them available to everyone. >> talk about the significance of him and the whole issue of patents with these companies. >> zackie ihop what is one of the great stories. -- achmat is one of the great stories. this was a very it delivered action that he took.
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he said in the film, he grew up in a family where his mother said, if one trout could not have chocolate, none of the children would get it. that is a simple way of looking at it, but something that we can all identify with. he grew up struggling against apartheid in south africa, a strong sense of solidarity with his fellow man. he could have easily accessed the drugs because he was an internationally known activist, but he said he was not going to do it. he was close to death by taking that decision. that had a very big impact of waking people in the western run up to the situation in sub- saharan africa. it paid off, so to speak. i feel like a gamble that he took -- he risked his life -- but in a sense, it paid off. the impact of what he did have repercussions throughout the world and will allow the people up to the situation. >> explain how the patents work.
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>> this is a government grant of the exclusivity which is given to companies generally, or individuals, with the idea that by giving a period of the exclusivity, one would incentivize investment. what typically happens with pharmaceutical companies, they will purchase technology from others, whether universities or biotech companies, or small innovative outfits, and then they will commercialize these products. because they have a monopoly for a period of time, usually a minimum of 20 years, they can set the price at any level they wish. we have the former vice president of pfizer who says openly that the concept is to maximize revenue, nothing to do with research and development. >> what needs to happen now?
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>> the realization that an inequitable situation exists and that millions of lives are at stake unless this agreement and patent issues are addressed, not for business, but we have to not hurt patients, as we have seen in the case of hiv/aids. >> thank you for being with us, dr. peter mugyenyi, dylan mohan gray, director of the new film that just premiered here, "fire in the blood." democracy now! is looking for feedback from people who appreciate the closed captioning. email your comments to or mail them to democracy now! p.o. box 693, new york, ny 10013. box 693, new york, ny 10013.
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Democracy Now
WHUT January 23, 2013 6:00pm-7:00pm EST

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